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Archiver > PAF-5-USERS > 2003-09 > 1063644662


From: "Jill A. Holmes" <>
Subject: Re: [PAF-5] State Abbreviations and USA
Date: Mon, 15 Sep 2003 09:51:02 -0700
References: <IJEIKFMIIHDKKBFPGGGIIEHOCAAA.rhaldy@comcast.net> <01d801c37ba7$a3396b70$c0adfd0c@CazierOffice>


Found the web site;
http://www.cannonfam.org/pafpal/

Notice at the bottom of the page that the email address is different
then what I posted. It has been updated.

Also check out www.paf-review.com for other programs that can 'attach'
itself to PAF.

Good luck,
Jill in CA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick Cazier" <>
To: <>
Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 9:37 AM
Subject: Re: [PAF-5] State Abbreviations and USA


> I have been following this subject with great interest. I'm now
convinced
> that the use of two letter state abbreviation postal codes is a bad
idea.
> But, almost all of my states are coded that way. My database
contains over
> 30,000 individuals. All of my place entries are in the smaller to
larger
> place sequence (i.e. Decatur, Macon, IL as City, County and State).
I some
> cases I have added a township name between the city and county or
have
> entered only the township name (followed by the abbreviation of
Twp.) or if
> the city is not known but township is, by omitting the city. All
have comma
> separations, so if any of the info is not known, there is a blank
comma in
> that spot. There are exceptions for some burials. All of my recent
ones
> are listed as Xyz Cemetery, City, County, State, but some of my
older ones
> are entered as City, County, State, Xyz Cemetery or Cem period.
>
> I am concerned about using a global find and replace approach. I'm
> wondering first if it is case sensitive. And will it replace place
names
> that start with the same two letters with the state name. As an
example, I
> have a place entered as Illiopolis, Macon, IL. Will that come out
as
> Illinois, Macon, Illinois if I try to use a global replacement of
comma IL
> to comma Illinois? Or what will happen to a cemetery entry when
the
> cemetery name is at the end of the entry?
>
> Obviously, with the size of my database, it is an unsurmountable
task to
> review each entry after a conversion to make sure it came out the
way I
> wanted it to.
> Dick Cazier
> Lakewood, CO
> To: <>
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2003 10:19 AM
> Subject: RE: [PAF-5] State Abbreviations and USA
>
>
> > And Greetings to you Richard R;
> >
> > Your point is valid and well stated. Abbreviations are dangerous
things.
> >
> > In partial support of your stated case you may remember the time,
perhaps
> > forty years ago, when we were encourage to abbreviate place names.
The
> rule
> > was to delete all vowels and truncate the name if it exceeded a
specified
> > number of letters (about fourteen letters, I think). I suspect
that this
> > was done to accommodate the limited length of the fields in the
IBM cards
> > that were used at that time to record information. As a result
the
> section
> > of the IGI labeled World Miscellaneous is cluttered with those
entries
> > because the computer cannot decipher those abbreviations.
Further, I have
> > heard that a team is working on expanding those abbreviations and
moving
> > those entries to the correct categories.
> >
> > In addition I have heard the suggestion that "shire" should be
added to
> all
> > of the county names in England. While I do not support the use of
any of
> > those county names abbreviated (e.g., Notts [or whatever the
current
> > abbreviation is] for Nottinghamshire). Neither do I automatically
add
> > "shire" to all of the county names because not all counties in
England are
> > Shire counties. For example in Northern England York is a shire
county
> > (Yorkshire) Durham (which is always written as "County Durham" is
not.
> >
> > Personally I spent more than thirty years puzzling over the
occupation of
> > one of my great grandfathers. His occupation was shown as "FWK",
I found
> > this in censuses and other documents. It must have been widely
understood
> > at that time (the early to middle 1800s). It was not until I
visited the
> > Lace Museum in Nottingham, England that I discovered it meant
FrameWork
> > Knitter, a worker in the lace industry. Lace was then produced on
large
> > machines that were constructed on cast iron frames.
> >
> > Abbreviations can be deliberately misused. The most egregious
misuse of
> an
> > abbreviation that I can remember occurred prior to WWII. At that
time
> Japan
> > was well known for producing shoddy goods. Products coming into
the
> United
> > States were required to be labeled with the place of origin. The
Japanese
> > renamed an island Usa. They then transshipped products through
that place
> > and labeled them "MADE IN USA" to deliberately obscure the origin.
> >
> > Another problem with place names that occasionally confuses the
Family
> > History Department computers is using Europe or a similar
continental
> > appellation following place names in a continent (e.g., Paris,
France,
> > Europe) (and, yes, I do know that Paris sprawls over about seven
> counties).
> >
> > In spite of the potential problems, I will continue to append USA
to the
> > place names of all localities in the United States of America. I
will do
> > this for several reasons. A major problem with using "United
States of
> > America" is its length. Even though PAF will accommodate a name
of that
> > length this forces it to truncate or abbreviate other parts of the
place
> > name when they are displayed. It will make the pattern of the
place names
> > consistent (i.e., the entry following the last comma will be a
national
> > name). I was unaware, and it is true that I should have realized,
that
> the
> > abbreviation for the Union of South Africa is U. S. A. I have two
friends
> > who lived there and my recollection is that they used "South
Africa"
> rather
> > than the formal "Union of South Africa". Even so in my limited
traveling
> > (some in the Far East, Middle East, North Africa, Europe and North
> America)
> > I have not found any English speaking person (my knowledge of
other
> > languages is limited to a smattering of Spanish) who failed to
recognize
> USA
> > and being the United States of America. Actually, I wish that we
had
> > adopted the suggested name Columbia while it was still available.
Further
> I
> > am uncomfortable calling myself an American meaning a citizen of
the US
> when
> > everyone born in North or South America is an American.
> >
> > Richard Halliday
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Richard Rands [mailto:]
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 10, 2003 12:50 PM
> > To: Richard L. Halliday
> > Subject: Re: [PAF-5] State Abbreviations and USA
> >
> >
> > Hi Richard,
> > > When I am teaching beginner classes I tell the students to
never use
> > >place name abbreviations. I then ask them "What does the
abbreviation
> 'AL'
> > >stand for; Alaska, Alabama or Alberta, Canada?". Another
treacherous one
> > is
> > >'Aust.' Is it Austria or Australia? Next I tell them to always
follow
> > >state names with USA.
> >
> > I wasn't going to raise an issue, but in the end couldn't hold
back. I
> > whole heartily endorse your instructions to never use place name
> > abbreviations. So much so that I gulped when you advocate the use
of the
> > abbreviation USA following state names. I have already
encountered
> > confusion with USA between US of America and Union of South
Africa. I
> have
> > already seen that there is a United States of Africa on the
drawing board
> > that was a topic of discussion during Bush's recent visit to
Aftrica.
> >
> > In my mind, using the abbreviation USA does not improve the place
name
> > designation any more than it adds to potential confusion, as long
as the
> > remaining place names are not abbreviated either. The only
exception I am
> > aware of so far is Georgia.
> >
> > I served a mission for the Church many years ago in Brazil. When
we sent
> > mail home to the USA, we were instructed to append the address
with the
> > abbreviation EEUU. I was told that it was the Brazilian
abbreviation for
> > USA. Once I learned enough of the language to wonder what EEUU
stood for,
> > it didn't make sense because the translation for USA is Estados
Unidos
> > d'America. I would have thought that the correct abbreviation
should be
> > EUA. I discovered that a letter with the abbreviation EUA would
be sent
> to
> > the United Emirates of Arabia. But why the double E and the
double U?
> >
> > The explanation was not logical. Since the actual name for Brazil
is the
> > United States of Brazil, they refused to use the single letters EU
for the
> > US. So their postal service specified that EEUU would be for the
USA. I
> > have traveled extensively around the world, and have yet to
encounter
> > someone who did not immediately understand "the United States" as
being
> > the USA. Even in foreign countries, a reference in the local
language to
> > "the United States" is still automatically assumed to mean the
> > USA. (Estados Unidos, Etas Unis, etc.) But the abbreviation EU
is now
> > widely used to mean the European Union. So you can understand why
I am
> > reluctant to advocate the use of USA in place names.
> >
> > The problem is tricky. I still believe that adding USA to a place
name
> > that contains a state name is not going to contribute anything,
and will
> > potentially cause confusion. Only when it stands alone, should it
be
> used,
> > and then I recommend spelling it out.
> >
> > Just my opinion
> >
> > Richard Rands
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ====
> > FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service
> > http://www.familysearch.org/
> >
>
>
>
> ==== PAF-5-USERS Mailing List ====
> PAF @ FamilySearch Internet Genealogy Service
> http://www.familysearch.org/eng/paf/
>

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