PHILLY-ROOTS-L ArchivesArchiver > PHILLY-ROOTS > 2000-04 > 0955405007
From: claire keenan <>
Subject: RE: [PHILLY-ROOTS-L] Who Bought the Plot?
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 18:16:47 -0400 (EDT)
This may help. The first thing I would do is get the lot profile either
from the cemetery or the Archdiocese. That will (usually) show who owns the
deed to the plot. In all the family plots I've looked at (but none as early
as this), no one has ever bothered to update the deed holder, so the info
shows who bought the plot (even if that person is long dead and even if s/he
is buried in the same cemetery), not the current deed holder.
You can get the info from the Archdiocese's Catholic Cemeteries Office. If
you have the plot info (section, range, and lot #), they send it to you for
free; if you don't have the plot info, they charge $15.
You can also get the info from Old Cathedral. I have called long distance
and left a message (fully expecting them not to return a long-distance
call), and they have returned my call within half an hour with the info of
who else is in the plot, what the section etc. info is, and even who's on
record as owning it. You may get all you need from Old Cathedral, or you
might use their info to get in touch with the Archdiocesan office (you have
to do this in writing--but they will fax you a form you can fax back--and it
will take maybe 2 weeks for them to get back to you).
At the very least, you will find out who all is buried there & their dates
of interment (which gives you an idea of DODs), so you can figure out who
the first person buried there was...and hopefully you'll know or be able to
figure out the family connections. And/or you can use his DOD to look for
an obit (the Free Library of Phila. will do this for free by mail), to see
what name it gives for him and whether he had a funeral Mass, and, if so, at
what church. Though Catholic churches do not keep funeral records, the
church should have a record of whether he was baptized while a parishoner
there (on his deathbed or earlier). If you're lucky, he will have been
buried from a funeral home (most of mine were buried from relative's homes,
unfortunately), and you can look at the funeral home records.
There's lots of avenues to pursue here. Hope this helps you to see a few.
From: "catherine r. buck" <>
Sent: April 10, 2000 9:30:17 PM GMT
Subject: [PHILLY-ROOTS-L] Who Bought the Plot?
Hi. Has anyone have any experience in asking the Archdiocese of
Philadelphia for information on who it was who paid for a burial plot in Old
Cathedral Cemetery in 1896?
The mystery is as follows:
My gr grandfather Bartine (no one ever called him anything else) BATES lived
with his daughter and son-in-law at the time of his death. (My
grandparents). They were quite young when he died in 1896, and probably
didn't own any cemetery lot or plot. And I'm quite sure Bartine didn't
either (he never had more than two nickels to rub together). They all lived
in the close vicinity of Old Cathedral Cemetery.
When I obtained Bartine BATES death record from the city of Philadelphia,
his name in flowing script was given as Bartine BATES. In what is
obviously an afterthought, the letter "J" was squeezed in front of his name
on the same line.
Today I received an answer from the Archdiocese to my inquiry about who all
is buried in the same plot with ----- Bartine Bates.
The answer came back as "Joseph" BATES. Same date. That's the answer to
Bartine was not baptised as a Catholic when he was born. My grandfather,
however, was a Catholic.
At my age, I'm quite sure that in 1896 the church wasn't about to bury
Bartine in their cemetery unless he'd been baptised as a Catholic.
So, how do I find out who paid for the lot where BARTINE BATES is buried,
and how do I find out if he wasf baptised on his death bed. Or maybe his
son-in-law bent the truth a little to get Bartine buried as close as
possible with as little effort as possible.
I'd like to be able to properly document that "Joseph" BATES and "J" Bartine
BATES are the same fellow.
Ruth in GA