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From: "Jerry Richmond" <>
Subject: Re: [Q-R] "Alice Wilsmith" source
Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 03:19:00 -0500
References: <20050721152348.85219.qmail@web30207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


List -

This query is probably very illustrative of the concept that the
archives of this List is one of the best sources to work. It may
not be the only source I used, but certainly the very first finding
from the 1998 Archive, which follows my keyline, is one of the very
best references that I had available to me several years ago.

Regards, Jerry Richmond
You are cordially invited to visit "The Quaker Collection"
http://home.sprynet.com/~jrichmon/qkrcoll.htm

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CNIDR Isearch-cgi 1.20.06 (File: 28)

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Date: Tue, 30 Jun 1998 23:04:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: <>
To:
Message-Id: <>
Subject: [LINDLEY-L] Lindley/Wilsmith/Parke Ireland
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Lindley, Parke, Wilsmith in Ireland

Recently I have been looking at the original Irish
Quaker records regarding James Lindley and Alice
Wilsmith and family to resolve some of the differences
in various published genealogies. This is what I have
found to date.

Olive C. Goodbody wrote a "Guide to Irish Quaker
Records 1654 - 1860", published by the Dublin
Stationary Office for the Irish Manuscripts Commission
in 1967. This is available at the Family History
Library in Salt Lake, and probably other places. She
states on page 9, "From the early registers indexes
were made in the last century which contain abstracts
of all births, marriages and deaths up to 1859, after
which date new books were put in use. "

These indexes have been microfilmed and can be ordered
at any LDS Family history Center, and you can check my
interpretation of the information below. There are
references to Lindleys in FHL film 0,571,398 in the
Wicklow Monthly Meeting, (Co. Wicklow) birth, marriage,
and death indexes. Elinor Parke is shown in FHL film
0,571,395 in the Carlow Monthly Meeting, (Co. Carlow)
birth and marriage index. The microfilms are hard to
use since there are no title pages, some pages are
unreadable, other pages are out of order, and the
format is different than most other films. Luckily the
Lindley pages are readable.

Page 49 of Goodbody's book lists the Wicklow Monthly
Meeting documents at the Society of Friends Historical
Library in Dublin and one of the documents is "Record
of Births, Deaths and Marriages 1677 - 1800" [W.5] (The
spline of the book was marked "No. 1, Wicklow Births,
Marriages, Deaths"). The paragraphs below were copied
from this book in May during a trip to Ireland.

James Linley's entry was on page 49 of that book as
follows:
"James Linley the son of John Linley was born in
Cheshire in the year 1641 and came into Ireland in the
year 1670. He took to wife Alice the daughter of
Thomas Wilsmith born in Yorkshire." This was followed
by a list of James' and Alice's children, Martha,
James, Thomas, and Mary, with their birth date and
locations exactly as listed below from the microfilmed
birth index.

The record of James Lindly and Elinor Park was on page
190:
"James Lindly son of James & Ealce (this is the way
Alice' appeared to me to be spelled in the document)
Lindly was born at Ballinaclash in Co. Wicklow 16th day
of 4th mo 1681. Has took to wife Elinor Parke Daughter
of Robert & Marjorie Parke, who was born at Ballyredman
in the Co. of Carlow about the year 1684, the 14 day of
the 4th month 1705 among friends as may appear by this
certificate recorded in the County book with issue as
follows:". It listed only Thomas and Rachel as
children.

The rest of the information below is from the
microfilms.

>From the Co. Wicklow Birth Index
(FHL film 0,571,398):
Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: Martha Linley
Date of Birth: 1678, mo 2, da 14
Place of Birth: Cronagallagh
Names of Parents: James and Alice
Parents Abode:
Description:

Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: James Linley
Date of Birth: 1681, mo 4, da 16
Place of Birth: Ballinaclash
Names of Parents: James and Alice
Parents Abode:
Description:

Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: Thomas Linley
Date of Birth: 1684, mo 1, da 11
Place of Birth: Ballinaclash
Names of Parents: James and Alice
Parents Abode:
Description:

Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: Mary Linley
Date of Birth: 1687, mo 8, da 16
Place of Birth: Ballinaclash
Names of Parents: James and Alice
Parents Abode:
Description:

Book: 1 Page: 190
Name: Thomas Lindly
Date of Birth: 1706, mo 2, da 25
Place of Birth: Wicklow
Names of Parents: James and Elenor
Parents Abode:
Description:

Book: 1 Page: 190
Name: Rachel Lindly
Date of Birth: 1707, mo 5, da 11
Place of Birth: Wicklow
Names of Parents: James and Elenor
Parents Abode:
Description:

>From the Co. Wicklow Marriage Index
(FHL film 0,571,398):
Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: James Linley
Residence:
Description:
Names of Parents: John & ______
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: Alice Wilsmith
Residence:
Where Married:
Date of Marriage:

Book: 1 Page: 49
Name: Alice Wilsmith
Residence:
Description:
Names of Parents: Thomas & _____ Wilsmith
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: James Linley
Residence:
Where Married
Date of Marriage:

Book: 1 Page: 104
Name: James Linley
Residence: Balinacargie
Description: Husbandman
Names of Parents:
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: Elizabeth Manliffe
Residence: Timullin
Where Married: Ballycane
Date of Marriage: 1693, mo 2, da 26

Book: 1 Page: 104
Name: Elizabeth Manliffe
Residence: Timullin
Description: Widow
Names of Parents:
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: James Linley
Residence: Ballynacargie
Where Married: Ballycane
Date of Marriage: 1693, mo 2, da 26

Book: 1 Page: 190
Name: James Lindly
Residence:
Description:
Names of Parents: James & Alice Lindly
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: Elinor Parke
Residence:
Where Married: Kilconnor Co. Carlow
Date of Marriage: 1705, mo 4, da 14

Book: 1 Page: 190
Name: Elinor Parke
Residence:
Description:
Names of Parents: Robert & Margery Parke
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: James Lindly
Residence:
Where Married: Kilconnor, Co. Carlow
Date of Marriage: 1705, mo 4, da 14

Carlow Monthly Meeting Marriage Index
(FHL film 0,571,395):
Book: 1 Page: 41
Name: James Lindley
Residence: Timullin, C Wicklow
Description: Cutler
Names of Parents: James & Alice Lindley
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: Eleanor Parke
Residence: Rathrush C. Carlow contra Rarush
Where Married: Kilconnor
Date of Marriage: 1705, mo 4, da 14

Book: 1 Page: 41
Name: Eleanor Parke
Residence: Rarush Co. Carlow contra Rathrush
Description:
Names of Parents:
Parents Abode:
To whom Married: James Lindley
Residence: Timullin
Where Married: Kilconnor
Date of Marriage: 1705, mo 4, da 14

Wicklow Monthly Meeting Death Index
(FHL film 0,571,398):
Book: 1 Page: 50
Name: Mary Linley
Date of Death: 1691, mo 11, da 1
Age: 4
Residence:
Description: Daughter of James & Alice
Date of Burial: 1691
Place of Burial: Ballymorane

Book: 1 Page: 50
Name: Alice Linley
Date of Death: 1691, mo 11, da 16
Age:
Residence:
Description: 1st Wife of James
Date of Burial: 1691
Place of Burial: Ballymorane

Book: 1 Page: 103
Name: James Linley
Date of Death: 1714, mo 5, da 16
Age: 73
Residence: Timulin Co. Wicklow
Description: Hus of Alice and Eliz
Date of Burial: 1714
Place of Burial: Ballymorane

Some comments:
The dates are as they are written in the documents.
Prior to 1752, the Julian calendar was in use, and the
Gregorian calendar after that. The first month in the
Julian calendar was March, and the new year began on
March 25th. Therefore, a Quaker date 1684 1st mo 11th
da is 11 March 1685 in our current calendar. For more
information see Andria Fiegel Wolfe
http:www.panix.com/~andria/quaker.html or
Ellen Thomas Berry & David Allen Berry
"Our Quaker Ancestors, finding them in Quaker Records"

In so far as possible, I typed the names exactly as
spelled as in the hand written registers and indexes.
Thus there are Linley, Lindly, and Lindley sometimes in
the same document. In Co. Wicklow there is also a John
Lively who married Alice Graily of Galway in 1660. It
is easy to misread the hand written words Linley and
Lively and some may have made wrong associations.

After Alice Wilsmith Linley died in 1692, it appears
that James remarried. There is no mention of a
daughter Isabella. In some genealogies, Isabella's
birthday is given as 1693. If this is true, she could
not be the daughter of Alice, but might be the daughter
of James and Elizabeth.

There are only 2 children of James and Elinor shown in
the Co. Wicklow Indexes. We could not find any Lindley
children in Co. Carlow documents even though some
genealogies list Co. Carlow birth places.

We took several days to tour the areas in which the
Parkes and Lindleys lived. In Co. Wicklow, the location
of the Penrose house in Ballykean (Ballycane) where the
Quaker meeting was held, and locations listed for
Lindley residences at Ballinaclash, Ballinacarrig
(Ballynacargie?), Timullin, and Cronesallagh. The
residences are all within 5 miles of each other.

In Co. Carlow, we located Ballyredmond (Ballyredman)
where Elinor Parke was born, Kilconnor where James and
Elinor were married, and residences at Rathrush and
Ballybromell. We also stopped at Ballytore where there
had been a large Quaker settlement, school and meeting
house. Several of the other Parke children were
married there. The meeting house is still used by the
Friends and the lower floor is a branch of the county
library with a small Quaker museum.

These townlands can be located on the Ordnance Survey
of Ireland, Discovery Series, 1:50 000, maps number 61
and 62. Co. Carlow and Wicklow are very pretty. The
country looks like the Midwest with green rolling
hills. Most of it was in grass with lots of sheep. It
would still be a nice place to live.

______________________________
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----- Original Message -----
From: "John McCarty" <>
To: <>
Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 10:23 AM
Subject: [Q-R] "Alice Wilsmith" source


> Jeff Palmer wrote:
> ""Alice Wilsmith" catches my eye. Wilsmith is widely believed to be the
> surname of the Alice who married George Maris (d. 15 Jan 1706), but this
has
> been discredited as only a misreading of bad handwriting on an original
> document. Unfortunately, the error keeps re-rising like in Night of the
> Living Dead as new researchers keep discovering the old secondary sources.
> An "Alice Wilsmith" marriage to a "James Lindley" is something I haven't
> seen, but I would guess it's a new twist on the old story. I'd be
> interested in a primary source or published secondary source for this
> marriage if you have it."
>
> The Alice Wilsmith data came from Jerry Richmond's site:
> http://home.sprynet.com/~jrichmon/lind2420.htm
>
> John McCarty
>
>
>
>
> ==== QUAKER-ROOTS Mailing List ====
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