SCT-STIRLINGSHIRE-L ArchivesArchiver > SCT-STIRLINGSHIRE > 2006-04 > 1144010733
From: "John Kane" <>
Subject: Re: [SCT-STIRLINGSHIRE] Re: MILLER & JAFFRAY
Date: Sun, 2 Apr 2006 21:45:33 +0100
References: <200603302100.k2UL0JWY017680@lists8.rootsweb.com> <0F2091D6-5189-4054-90A1-B3F316D5F6F4@paradise.net.nz>
I had a look at the FreeCen site but the 1841 records are not available yet.
Our second grandchild is going to be Scottish, so we'll be spending some
time there this summer. A good time to do some research I think!
I bit the bullet and downloaded the image for the Birth of Agnes MILLER in
Glasgow Central, 1857. There were two, and I chose the wrong one first of
course! Father is John MILLER and mother is Agnes MILLER, maiden name
MILLER. So it looks like the IGI transcription was ok.
However, John's occupation is interesting - 'Labourer in Chemical Works'.
Doesn't seem right for a Tile Maker come Blacksmith, but when searching for
him in 1861 I found a married Lodger in Walker, Northumberland (near where
the family finished up) with the exact same occupation. Unfortunately he was
10 years too old. But when his son John married he said his father was John
MILLER, a 'Professor of Chemistry'! Maybe he was having a laugh, but I
suspect it was something he was told. When his sister Ellen married she said
he was a 'Joiner'. Very complicated :)
I think the marriage in St Ninians for John MILLER and Agnes MILLER is
looking very good now. Its a shame these images are not available on
Scotlands People yet. I'll wait to see if anything else turns up before
spending £10 on the image.
I haven't been able to find a Death for Agnes DOUGLAS in the Stirling area.
But its looking like the family moved to Chester via Glasgow. I found Daniel
and William JAFFRAY lodging in Chester in 1861.
I hope we can make a connection with these families.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Catherine Fitchett" <>
Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 6:00 AM
Subject: [SCT-STIRLINGSHIRE] Re: MILLER & JAFFRAY
> Someone on the list was indexing the 1841 census of St Ninians for the
> free census project. I don't think it has been checked and validated and
> put up on the internet yet though. You could check - google on "free
> census" and you should find it.
> I myself did the 1841 census for Stirling burgh for the same project, and
> again it is not available on the site yet. I think you want St Ninians
> though, not Stirling.
> If you are near a LDS centre you can order the microfilm in. It is not
> too large to search through for the family in Cambusbarron or indeed to
> check the whole of St Ninians if need be.
> I checked on the LDS website for the birth of Agnes Miller in 1858 using
> the search parameters father John Miller, mother Agnes, birth in 1857 or
> two years either side (the "b 1858" usually means that her age was given
> as 13 and she was most probably born in 1857 since the census was early
> in the year)
> I found only one - Agnes Miller born 23 August 1857 Central District,
> Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland parents John Miller and Agnes Miller. Obviously
> you wanted Agnes Jaffray but maybe the entry said her mother was Agnes
> Miller, ms Jaffray and the transcriber missed the Jaffray or maybe the
> entry omitted her maiden surname. It would be worth checking this birth
> entry on Scotlandspeople.
> Another possibility is that Agnes's mother was married more than twice. I
> also found a birth for William Miller in Central District, Glasgow 22 Jun
> 1856 to the same couple.
> And a John Miller married to Agnes Miller on 14 Oct 1849 in St Ninians -
> so I am beginning to believe strongly that this may be your couple.
> Also bear in mind that widows in particular but also married women often
> appear in the census in Scotland under their maiden name. Using your
> husband's name was an English practice which crept in gradually.
> So, Agnes Douglas could be her maiden name. She could be Agnes Douglas
> who first married a Miller and had a daughter Agnes, and then married a
> Jaffray and had other children. She should then have her death indexed
> under Douglas, Miller and Jaffray if both husbands are named on her death
> I have a note of a sasine entry for Henry Jaffray, gardener Cambusbarron
> as heir to his father Alexander in 1859. This may be of relevance.
> I have both Millers and Jaffrays in some of my family lines but no proof
> at present that they are connected to yours. If John Miller's wife was
> indeed Agnes Miller I wonder if they were related?