SOUTH-AFRICA-L ArchivesArchiver > SOUTH-AFRICA > 2004-11 > 1101268243
From: "Marlene \(Meerkat\) Spies" <>
Subject: Ziehl ?s - German immigrant arriving 1858
Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:50:46 -0500
(Resending - sent to the list from my other email address before, not subscribed to RootsWeb. Hope only one goes through!)
Good day from Southern Ontario, Canada!
I'm trying to find information about the German settlers in South Africa in the late 1850s (peasants in this case, I think, not legionaries from the Crimean war). Links and websites are below.
Having moved countries ourselves in the last decades (moved from South Africa to Ontario, Canada in 1997), I can't even begin to imagine the hardship these people had, and how they made a living for themselves in the new country!
I've always been interested in my family history, but this is the first time I've actually sat down and tried to find specific information. During the last few weeks, I got bits and pieces, and not much real info or proof of info yet. The problem is also that all grandparents, uncles and aunts are by now deceased. Only my dad is still alive, and he doesn't remember many names, dates, etc.
So - I use the internet, NAAIRS, questions to people who might know or remember, and research. Thank you in advance for any help, info or links you might pass on to me, or know of!
I'm looking for information about the surname ZIEHL in South Africa, please.
For this email, I'm referring mostly to information found on the following pages:
Passengers on the Wandrahm
According to the website, Carl W. Ziehl (33), married to Dorothea (38), one child, Theodor (<1) arrived in South Africa on the Wandrahm on Dec 8, 1858.
I have info (but not solid proof yet) of
Carl Friedrich Ziehl (no age given), married about 1849 to Dorothea Kaufman (born about 1820) - which would make her 38 in 1858. His death date is given as 27 MAY 1896 (Familysearch.org)
Would that be the same person as Carl W from the website? The second initial is confusing me.
I also have a Carl Friedrich Ziehl, who died in 1896, and a NAAIRS KAB listing for the same name, death date 1896. (KAB; Ref. 1425; Death Notice)
Then I have a Carl Friedrich Ziehl, same death date as above given, who married Marie Louise Ziemann around 1865 in East London. That might be a second marriage; it sounds about right.
No specific information about either marriage children, other than the Theodor (mother Dorothea) mentioned on the listing page of the website re German immigrants.
So - were there two Ziehls? One CF Ziehl and one CW Ziehl? Or is the W a mistake and it should be an F?
Here is where I found listings of Ziehl in 1858:
Passengers on the Wandrahm
And then a listing of "Ziel", but it might be just a typo - for Carl Ziel on
On Familysearch.org, I found a whole list of children, supposedly belonging to Carl Friedrich Ziehl and Marie Louise Ziemann. One of these boys was my great-grandfather, William Robert Ziehl. He married Catharina Susanna Scheepers Krog around 1904. (According to my memory of family history, etc. that is correct. My great-grandmother died when I was about 14.)
I do not find any mention of Theodor again. He would have been born in 1858 if he was not yet 1 year old when his parents arrived in South Africa in Dec. 1858.
However, there must be some Theodore somewhere in the family, as my grandfather was named Carl Theodore Ziehl.
Mind you - I just did a search for "Theodor Ziel" on impulse on Familysearch.org and found one Theodor Adam Ziehl, born 26 Jun. 1858; child of Carl Friedrich Ziehl and Dorothea Kaufmann. Death 24 NOV 1890 ; marriage Anna Schultz of Germany, about 1883. That could be him, but I didn't find any more mention of either of them.
Then - to confuse matters further - my family history stories said that two Ziehl brothers came in around 1820 or thereabouts. I am now drawing from memory as a child; it might not be correct. However, I do know that a William Robert Ziehl, described as "a young man from Natal", was in Rhodesia in the late 1800s. He got into some trouble with the local tribes; I'm awaiting that information to be sent via snailmail from Scotland.
Where would he have come from? I always thought the two brothers to come in from Germany, were William Robert and Carl Theodore Ziehl, but of course that could have been confused with other names.
Thank you very much for any information you can give me, or research you can refer me to, or books you can recommend. I'll try to get someone to look at the death notices for Carl Friedrich Ziehl and others; perhaps there will be some more information too. Together we might piece it together yet for someone else who might also be doing research for this surname.
Greetings from lovely Southern Ontario
Marlene Spies (born Ziehl)