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Archiver > Scotch-Irish > 1998-02 > 0887400478

From: John Carpenter <>
Subject: Re: Savage - Fermanagh
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:07:58 -0800 (PST)

see guys, we do do genalogy on this list. Linda,
that's wonderful. I have Savages in TN and MS as one
of my ancestral first cousin
married a Savage before the Civil War and several
Honnolls with Savage in their ancestry married my
McElhannon and Potts cousins.

---linda Merle wrote:
> Hi Gaye,
> > Descendants in Australia claim they
> > referred to themselves as Scotch-Irish.
> > How would I go about determining whether this is
true and, hence, when and
> > where they came from in Scotland?
> The really correct answer is you'd trace them
backwards to where
> they came from Scotland. This isn't terribly easy
-- or even possible.
> You can make assumptions if they are Presbyterians
and seemed (or
> you seem) culturally Ulster Scots.
> Surname origin is no proof, but for what it is
worth, Savage is
> Norman in origin. The name is common in Down,
according to Bell
> "The Book of Ulster Surnames", from old French
salvage --from
> Latin silvaticus "wild". The orign is Le Secur
Thomas le
> Sauvagewho came to England with William the C and
settled in
> Derbyshire. His son William le Savage, b c 1150,
took part in
> the Anglo Norman invasion of Ireland, coming in
1177 to Ulster
> with John de Courcy. He was granted land in Upper
Ards in Co
> Down and built "a stronghold" at Ardkeen and became
an Ulster
> baron. His descendents held their land for 300
years against the
> Gaelic septs but became 'hibernicised". In the
Annals of the
> Four Masers they recorded as Mac an tSabhaisigh.
Sir Roland
> Janico Savage, Lord of Lecale, was in 1482
seneschal of Ulser. He
> was described by the Lord Deputy of Ireland as "the
most famous
> of the English of the province for his exploits
against the
> Irish.", but he revolted in 1515. By the end of
the 16th century
> the lord of the family was listed as an important
Ulster rebel.
> The next generation Henry Savage married into the
> family. Though the 1641 rebeling left Ards
untouched, it is
> beleived this marriage saved the family from
disposession. They
> were STILL HOLDING the land granted to William 800
years before.
> It's not clear from the book if they rebelled or if
the saving
> was from the Irish, who went for the English first
(saving the
> Scots for "last").
> A group of Savages in Portaferry became Nugents in
1814 when
> an Andrew Savage, 1770-1846, high sheriff of Down,
adopted the name
> because he inherited a fortune from his great uncle
> John Nugent of Westmeath.
> Thanks for asking -- I learned all this history.
Now the list
> has only has a couple questions of you: Are you
rich too? And
> if so, can we all come and stay free at your
> Seriously, I suspect if you can tie your family
into this one,
> you will trace your family farther than most of us.
I'd check
> LDS catelog for published genealogies.
> Lisvoy must be a town....anyone know?
> Linda Merle

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