RootsWeb: TRANSITIONAL-GENEALOGISTS-FORUM-L Re: [TGF] Mary Petty - a transitional-genealogist'sviewpointonProfessional Genealogy

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Archiver > TRANSITIONAL-GENEALOGISTS-FORUM > 2008-02 > 1202600768

From: "Melissa Barker" <>
Subject: Re: [TGF] Mary Petty - a transitional-genealogist'sviewpointonProfessional Genealogy
Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2008 17:46:08 -0600
References: <BAY132-W6A5D332879BE716751A8A92280@phx.gbl><27329362.4671202571603612.JavaMail.root@mbs4.homesteadmail.com><007701c86b51$8a3744a0$6801a8c0@MAMA><5603514DC43646BEACA74F7898B46D9A@JackPC>

Dear Jack, Thank You for Your Post! I totally agree with every word! Sincerely, Melissa Barker Genealogist for Tennessee and Kentucky ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Butler" <> To: <> Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2008 5:16 PM Subject: Re: [TGF] Mary Petty - a transitional-genealogist's viewpointonProfessional Genealogy > Because I have been told that I have a tendency to be a little too direct, > and because I knew that feelings can be tender on this topic, I have sat > quietly watching the ball bounce back and forth on this issue. But some > buttons have finally been pushed that requirement me to thrown my two > cents > worth into the ring. First, let me say that I am of the camp that favors > the APG being more proactive in promoting professional genealogy, but I > sit > well outside the camp that desires regulation and licensure. I think that > the field must be encouraged to become more professional, but I am not yet > convinced that we need to become a profession in the sense that medicine > or > law are considered professions. > > And I am certainly not convinced by Mary's essay on "professionally > designated" professionals. Frankly, I find the term "professionally > designated" to be a largely meaningless. Simply put, Ph.D.s and Ed.D.s > are > earned degrees and are not "professionally designated" in any way. They > are > awarded by educational institutions based on the scholar meeting a set of > criteria established by the institution in accordance with the > requirements > of the institution's accrediting body. Some professional educators - > particularly those teaching at the K-12 levels - require teaching licenses > or certificates; the specific requirements vary from state to state. In > higher education, advanced degrees qualify the practitioner for teaching > and > licensing is not required. The "industry" does not regulate educators - > the > schools, school boards, or universities/colleges that hire and/or govern > them do. > > Medicine has almost literally nothing in common with genealogy and using > the > profession as a model for our own profession strikes me as senseless. It > is > very difficult for me to envision a situation in which a professional > genealogist performed so badly that the client died from the malpractice. > > As for accounting, unfortunately the point is not valid at all. Yes, some > accountants elect to take the examination and to become CPAs. And yes, > the > CPA designation does give the public more confidence that an accountant > has > demonstrated, at a specific point in his/her life, a solid knowledge of > the > field. Other than auditing, however, no accounting field requires a CPA - > and even there certification is only required he accountants who attest to > the accuracy of financial statements. And that is a government > requirement, > not a requirement of the accounting profession. Also, CPAs are regulated > by > the State government, not the accounting profession. > > Finally, the simple fact is that far more accountants work in the business > and the financial world without becoming certified than ever become CPAs. > To > say that these accountants are not professionals simply because they did > not > become certified is nonsense. Non-certified accountants work in every > accounting field, holding positions from bookkeepers through Corporate > Controller and Chief Financial Officer. And, yes, the non-certified > accountants have their own national and international professional > associations. > > If we are going to pick a profession to which genealogy is to be compared, > why not consider historian? That profession is far more in line with what > we do than medicine or law will ever be. > > Finally, please tell me what agency or institution has ever > "professionally > designated" any genealogist. The university that awarded the BA degree in > genealogy did not "professionally designate" the recipient as a > professional > genealogist - they simply certified that you met at least minimum > requirements for a BA degree with a major course of study in the field. > The > certifying or accrediting bodies that issue credentials do not > "professionally designate" one as a professional genealogist. All that > they > do is verify that one has a good foundation in the field. > > In the end, all professionals are self-designated. Some professions simply > require the self-designator to jump through more hoops than others. > > Jack Butler > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mary E. Petty - Heirlines, Inc" <> > To: <> > Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2008 2:25 PM > Subject: [TGF] Mary Petty - a transitional-genealogist's viewpoint > onProfessional Genealogy > > >> Dear Dee Dee and Carolyn, >> >> As practitioners in the industry of Professional Genealogy move towards >> professional designation and leave self-appointment behind as >> unprofessional, I am glad to hear that APG is interested in the views of >> a >> transitional-genealogist. Here are some of my thoughts and solutions for >> APG, today's practitioners, the Industry and the future of Professional >> Genealogy. >> >> I am a transitional-genealogist. I am very interested in this discussion >> on Professional Genealogy Research Services having worked with a >> professionally designated genealogist, James W. Petty, AG, CG, B.A. >> (History) B.S. (Genealogy) for nearly 40 years. >> >> Dee Dee King quoted me: >> "Since becoming a member of APG, there are frequent discussions, as Mary >> Petty mentioned: >> >> ... the professional route to designation as a professional >> genealogist/practitioner, the standards and the best practices (etc) of >> the professional genealogy research services industry. In our evolving >> industry, a discussion on these elements and a key player - the >> transitional-genealogist - is essential. .... And so we can not escape >> from a discussion about these elements because they will shape the >> practice and behavior of professional genealogy research services." As >> there are frequent discussions about defining the various specialties and >> even the term professional genealogist. Carolyn was somewhat goaded into >> taking on that little project. :-)" >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Every profession has the challenge and the responsibility to identify its >> practioners and standardize the route to professionalism in their field. >> To provide a sound and viable marketplace, each industry must educate the >> public as to who is qualified and a valid and recognized practitioner in >> the industry. Because professions desire to have a hand in their own >> destiny outside of governmental control, because future qualified >> practitioners are desired to continue the industry, because professional >> designation is in the best interests of and does serve the good will of >> the industry, the practitioner, the general public, the consumer, the >> hobbyist, future practitioners, and governments - the professional >> credentialing process has been developed and instituted as the route to >> professional designation as an industry-specific practioner. The >> hallmarks of this process are Qualifier, Credibility, and Accountability. >> >> Let's look at 4 professions- >> >> Professional Genealogy is the industry name - the highest level of >> practitioner is professionally designated a Professional Genealogist. >> Entry level practitioner may be earned or self- designated and is >> unlicensed - except for business license, and is non-industry regulated. >> >> >> Professional Education is the industry name - the highest level of >> practitioner is professionally designated a Ph.D. or Ed.D. Entry level >> practitioner is earned and licensed and industry regulated. >> >> Medicine is the industry name - the highest level of Practitioner is >> professionally designated a M.D. Entry level practitioner is earned and >> licensed and industry regulated. >> >> Accounting is the industry name - the highest level of practitioner is >> professionally designated a CPA. Entry level practitioner is earned and >> licensed and industry regulated. >> >> Each one of these industries of professional education, medicine, >> accounting and professional genealogy has an industry-specific route for >> entry where professional status is earned and provides levels for growth >> and development. Industry-specific means earning the practitioner >> professional title, protected status, and qualified stature in the field >> of medicine, professional education, accounting and professional >> genealogy. As an emerging profession, only Professional Genealogy allows >> earned professional designation and self appointment to practice >> professional genealogy research services ; and as of yet, is the only >> profession here listed as having no industry-specific self-regulation or >> governmental licensure. >> >> >> The route to professional designation is earned and industry-specific. >> It >> is the same for all four listed professions - ( ee description below - >> all >> except #7) >> >> First- formal career college academic education/degree; >> Second - formal career training/internship; >> Third - formal career membership (either governmental regulated and >> recognized like Medicine or industry regulated and recognized like >> astronomy) where the career practitioner joins a qualified members-only >> body that can honor, censure and/or boot him out depending upon his >> performance as a practitioner. The practitioner takes an oath to live by >> industry methodology and standards of production, ethics and business >> requirements including continuing education; >> Fourth - formal career experience/on the job experience following >> education and training; >> Fifth - formal career credentials and certifications; >> Sixth - business license >> Seventh - Government Licensure - an additional level of Governmental >> regulation and licensure for Medicine, Accounting, and Professional >> Education - it has not happened to Professional Genealogy yet. >> >> Each of the above mentioned industries started at something less than >> what >> we in professional genealogy recognize today as professionally designated >> and professional. Grandfathering in qualified practitioners was >> paramount >> to starting off with a clean slate and a clear vision for the future. I >> see this happening here in Professional Genealogy as it has occurred in >> the past for Professional Education, Medicine and Accounting. >> >> I hope as you gather information from this transitional-genealogist forum >> and the APG-L, you will also be contacting the professionally designated >> practitioners who adhere to the highest standards of professionalism in >> the Professional Genealogy Industry. Otherwise, it will be the tail >> wagging the dog. And in the end when government comes a calling, the >> professional designated alone will have the evidence and the proof for >> their professional status and ya'll might not like how Government does >> the >> grandfathering. >> >> One interesting side note - two of America's most prominent >> professionally >> designated genealogists (both have industry-specific degrees, >> credentials, >> membership and so on) do not qualify to professionally teach genealogy at >> an accredited university because they only have a bachelor's degree in >> the >> field - all that was available when they began their careers in the >> 1960's. That is a Professional Education qualifying rule. So who will >> professionally teach the next generation - not today's professionally >> designated genealogist! Just something to think about. >> >> >> >> >> Sincerely yours, >> >> Mary E. Petty, B.A. >> ============================================================== >> Ancestors are the People of History. Do you know who yours >> are?<br><br>Let the Professionals at HEIRLINES Family History & Genealogy >> find your ancestry! >> 1-800-570-4049 ▪ www.heirlines.com ▪ PO Box 893 ▪ Salt Lake City, UT >> 84110 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: >> [mailto:] On Behalf >> Of >> Dee Dee King >> Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2008 8:40 AM >> To: >> Subject: Re: [TGF] transitional genealogists >> >> Thanks to all the folks who responded positively, espcially all the >> private email! >> >> Since becoming a member of APG, there are frequent discussions, as Mary >> mentioned: >> >> ... the professional route to designation as a professional >> genealogist/practitioner, the standards and the best practices (etc) of >> the professional genealogy research services industry. In our evolving >> industry, a discussion on these elements and a key player - the >> transitional-genealogist - is essential. .... And so we can not escape >> from a discussion about these elements because they will shape the >> practice and behavior of professional genealogy research services. >> >> As there are frequent discussions about defining the various specialties >> and even the term professional genealogist. Carolyn was somewhat goaded >> into taking on that little project. :-) >> >> I'll create a little questionnaire, totally anonymous and private for >> those who volunteer to be guinea pigs. Let's answer some of the >> questions >> that come up in these discussions and quantify the responses to replace >> our usual empirical responses. Much of the discussion about >> "professionalizing the profession" centers on you guys and "future >> professionals". So ya'll are the perfect guinea pigs for a questionnaire >> about how folks are coming to this profession now. What ya'll need and >> expect. Give me a bit of time to get this all worked out. I'd like to >> write up the results to submit an article, perhaps for the APGQ. >> Thanks, Ya'll! >> >> Dee >> >> >> >> -- >> Dee Dee King, Certified Genealogist >> www.ForensicGenealogyServices.com >> 133 N Friendswood Dr Suite 325 >> Friendswood TX 77546 >> telephone/fax 281-431-3525 >> Member Association of Professional Genealogists, >> Event Coordinator of the Lone Star Chapter. >> >> CG and Certified Genealogist are Service Marks of the >> Board for Certification of Genealogists used under >> license after periodic evaluations by the Board. >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the >> message >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the >> message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > message -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. 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