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From: "Jack Butler" <>
Subject: Re: [TGF] Certification vs. education (Was: Usability[wasGenealogyas a discipline])
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2010 14:10:02 -0700


I do not want to give the wrong impression - I have no problem with ICE and
its certifying board. I just point out that they were not annointed or
appointed by any suerior governing authority - they appointed themselves to
their current position. The only reason that their certification carries any
weight is that the member organizations take it seriously and agree that it
does. Pretty much like most of the genealogy field treats the BCG and its
certification.



Would it be better to have the BCG's standards and methods of assessment
signed off on by the ICE's accrediting board? Maybe. Would it mean anything
to the genealogy customer. Almost certainly not.



Genealogy may eventually get to where you and Mary Petty apparently want it
to go. But it won't do it in my lifetime. In the meantime, the BCG serves a
good and worthwhile purpose in its certification function.



Look at it this way - you and your husband run a college that is neither
regionally or nationally accredited. Now I spent a good many years in the
higher education field and I know that unaccredited colleges are largely
discounted and looked down on by colleges and universities that are
accredited by one of the regional accrediting bodies. Does that make the
training or education that your school offers illegitimate or without
value?



If not, doesn't that double standard make your stance toward the BCG
somewhat hypocritical?



Jack Butler



-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [TGF] Certification vs. education (Was: Usability
[wasGenealogyas a discipline])
From: Jeanette Daniels <>
Date: Wed, January 27, 2010 3:39 pm
To:
Jack,
The person I talked with this morning told me that the boards it certifies
are
recognized as certified by the US government. That does not mean that the
government is behind the certification. It does mean that ICE has gone
through proper channels to be able to certify boards in the United States.
I believe that ICE certification of a board means that that board has gone
through
the certifying process, is operating properly so that the consumer does not
need
to worry about the status of the certification that he/she has, and that
legally there should
be no problem with presenting evidence in court or any other legal situation
because your
certification would be recognized as a legal, valid certification.
The person who wrote that she was a person with no interest with either side
made
good points. Why encourage the need for board certification as a board
(meaning
BCG) and not be willing to do the same with the entity that would legally
give you
credibility as a certifying board? She saw a double standard. I believe
that others
may as well. As she put it, is it OK for her to just look at the standards
on the
website and say that is enough? She had very good questions. This is food
for
thought for all of us. It has been an interesting discussion. I have
appreciated the
tone and ability for all to express their personal ideas.
I believe that genealogy as a profession will need certification based upon
formal, meaning
degreed education, work experience, and rigorous ceritification testing in
the future as
the occupations that genealogists do keeps expanding to need these
requirements.
Thanks,
Jeanette
----- Original Message ----
From: Jack Butler <>
To:
Sent: Wed, January 27, 2010 12:47:57 PM
Subject: Re: [TGF] Certification vs. education (Was: Usability
[wasGenealogyas a discipline])
Sorry, Jeanette, but you clearly misunderstand what ICE is and does. The
federal government did work with the old agency, the National Commission
for
Health Certifying Agencies to establish standards for the
evaluation of organizations that certified various types of medical
personnel.
But back in 1989 the folks at the NCHCA saw an opportunity to expand their
business into the accreditation of all manner of certifying bodies. The
government plays no no role in ICE's expanded role - it does not grant ICE
any kind of authority, etc. and it does not evaluate ICE's current
performance. The only ones looking over ICE's shoulder at this point is
the
American National Standards Institute - and it accredits ICE as a
Standard's
developer.
You are simply incorrect about a government involvement.
And I am back to my original question - what benefit does a CG holder gain
if BCG submits to ICE for certification?
Jack Butler
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