RootsWeb: GENEALOGY-DNA-L Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates

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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2005-01 > 1105747068

From: Charles <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2005 18:57:48 -0500
References: <20050114233122.3430.qmail@web60908.mail.yahoo.com>
In-Reply-To: <20050114233122.3430.qmail@web60908.mail.yahoo.com>

Ruy, Thank you for your input. I will have to read up on those two terms. Charles Kerchner Emmaus PA Y-STR Haplotype Average Mutation Rate Log: http://www.kerchner.com/cgi-kerchner/ystrmutationrate.cgi Ruy Cardoso wrote: >>From: Charles <> >> >>Ann, >> >>And further to my hypothesis and your suggested game >>of pulling cards from a deck of cards and counting >>the hearts, suppose I made up 1000 decks of cards >>each with a different number of hearts in it, some > > > [snip] > > Y'all need some terminology. Try these two terms: > (1) process risk, and (2) parameter risk. > Essentially, the first corresponds to the different > values (number of hearts) that you get from Ann's > original analogy, the one where the number of hearts > in the deck is known. The second corresponds to the > hypothesized ignorance of the number of hearts in the > deck that Charles is trying to get across. > > If all you have are the outcomes from the experiment, > then you can break the variation into the > corresponding two pieces: X amount of variation is > what you would expect if there were in fact 13 hearts > in the deck and if you ran the experiment Y number of > times. Pretty much any variation beyond that could be > considered as coming from parameter risk (if you > define parameter risk broadly enough). One could make > the analogy more complicated, of course -- vary the > total number of cards in the deck, for example -- but > I think you might find these two terms to come in > handy for the purpose of moving this discussion along. > > Ruy Cardoso > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. > http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 > > > ============================== > Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the > last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx > > >

This thread:

Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- the one size shoe/(haplotypemutation rate) fits all approach is not valid, imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
- Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- the one size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid, imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
  - Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
    - RE: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- the one size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid, imo -- corrected URL link by "Whit Athey" <>
      - Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
        RE: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- the one size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid, imo -- corrected URL link by "Terry Barton" <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- the one size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid, imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
    - Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
      - Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by (John Chandler)
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by Charles <>
        Calculating the observed mutation rate [was: Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates...] by (John Chandler)
        [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by (John Chandler)
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates -- theone size shoe/(haplotype mutation rate) fits all approach is not valid,imo -- corrected URL link by "robert mclaren" <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        RE: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by "Fran Akridge" <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Ruy Cardoso <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        Slander? by "Eric Olson" <>
        Book Review, Not Slander by "Ken Forbes" <>
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        RE: [DNA] Slander? by "Mark MacDonald" <>
        RE: [DNA] Slander? by
        Re: [DNA] Slander? by "G. O'Flannagain" <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Gordon Hamilton <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by "Phil Goff" <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by Charles <>
        Re: [DNA] Male Line Specific Y-STR Average Mutation Rates by