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Archiver > GENEALOGY-DNA > 2007-02 > 1171416205


From: Vincent Vizachero <>
Subject: Re: [DNA] There is no WAMH (R1b modal) cluster
Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:23:25 -0600
References: <992944.48486.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
In-Reply-To: <992944.48486.qm@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


On Feb 13, 2007, at 5:42 PM, Jim T wrote:

> This is probably obvious to those who have been looking for
> clusters; they haven't found a cluster whose modals match the
> R1b modals. It wasn't obvious to me a couple of years ago when
> I first read about WAMH and clusters in R1b. I pictured the
> structure of R1b as a tree with WAMH as the trunk, and the
> various clusters as branches from the main trunk. I was puzzled
> back then when I searched on the 37-marker R1b modals and found
> no exact matches and few close matches. The picture has become
> very clear now that there are over 800 67-marker R1b haplotypes
> in Ysearch. R1b consists of many clusters, large and small,
> that are not particularly close to the WAMH or, in most cases,
> to each other.

One thing to keep in mind is that the WAMH was never meant to
represent the modal for R1b1c (much less R1b) as a whole, but merely
a "cluster" of R1b1c found in western Europe.

Analysis of R1b1c in Europe is made difficult, as others have
observed, by the existence of several distinct SNP-defined subclades
that apparently had founders with very similar STR haplotypes - thus
the "shrub not a bush" appearance. STR-based analysis has proven
particularly frustrating in R1b1c as a result.

Vince

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