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Archiver > Y-DNA-HAPLOGROUP-I > 2009-04 > 1238870602


From: "Ken Nordtvedt" <>
Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] I2a2-Isles Clades Divide Again
Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2009 12:43:22 -0600
References: <000701c9b54e$b3e0f1f0$6400a8c0@Ken1><bc5d72880904041126m7f6a1eacj831148933ede3c85@mail.gmail.com>


"Isles-E" with "E" being inspired by "English" is a clade of M284+ I2b1a.
It is clearly older than "Isles-Scot" clade of M284+

My newly mentioned divisions of Isles clades this morning refer to
I2a2-Isles M423+ haplogroup. These are quite separate populations.

I have used the descriptor "Isles" more than once in haplogroup I. This is
because haplogroup I entered Europe from its southeast corner in most
liklihood. It spent the LGM in various southern refuges, probably mostly
the Balkans or the Danube basin. When I find relatively old clades of
haplogroup I almost exclusively found in the British Isles at the opposite
corner of Europe, that seems significant, so I use "Isles" as nickname and
reminder of its special geographic characteristic. One thing it suggests is
that several clades of haplogroup I repopulated the British Isles
substantially before the Roman era.

Ken


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Godbey" <>
To: <>
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 12:26 PM
Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] I2a2-Isles Clades Divide Again


> Ken, I don't have the ability to view your data at home.
>
> Where does Isles-English fall into your new chart?
>
> On 4/4/09, Ken Nordtvedt <> wrote:
>> There have been four I2a2-Isles M423+ L69- clades for some time, one
>> being
>> clearly older than the other three, and all having strong affinity to
>> Ireland. Due to more haplotypes found from another database, I can
>> clearly
>> divide each of those four clades, A,B,C,D, into two parts giving
>> A1,A2,B1,B2,C1,C2,D1,D2 clades of I2a2-Isles
>>
>> As clades get younger there is less noise to obscure key shifts on two or
>> three defining clade markers. I believe I can see in these divisions
>> differences between the Irish fraction versus rest of British Isles, but
>> this needs confirming by more detailed checking.
>>
>> These new founder haplotypes can be seen at
>> http://knordtvedt.home.bresnan.net and file FounderHaps.xls which has the
>> inferred founding haplotypes for all the clades in haplogroup I
>>
>> Ken
>>
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